19 November Webinar

19 November Webinar

by Sylvia Currie -
Number of replies: 5

Reminder! The first Footprints of Emergence webinar takes place tomorrow!

WhenTuesday, 19 November 18:00 GMT, 10:00 PST

WhereSCoPE Blackboard Collaborate Room: http://urls.bccampus.ca/scopeevents

What: We will discuss what emergent learning is and the progress of our research. This will be followed by asynchronous discussion in the forum, where we can discuss further questions and any issues arising from the webinar.

How to prepare:

  • If you are new to Blackboard Collaborate check that your equipment is ready ahead of the session.
  • Plan to join a few minutes prior to the start of the event.
  • Enter your full name when prompted.

Note: You may enter the Blackboard Collaborate room at any time to ensure there are no technical issues. 

This is an open invitation so please spread the word! 

In reply to Sylvia Currie

Re: 19 November Webinar

by Sylvia Currie -

Thank you Jenny, Roy, and Simone for such an engaging webinar today, and thanks everyone for your engagement! 

Here is the recording for those who were time (or time zone) challenged, and also for those who wish to revisit. 


We're busy converting the recording to other formats, and will post those links soon. Normally an audio-only format isn't ideal when there is a lot of whiteboard activity, but Jenny did a fantastic job of vocalizing our brainstorm :-)

Also, a few other harvests are forthcoming... whiteboard snapshots and text chat archive. 

In reply to Sylvia Currie

Re: 19 November Webinar

by Jenny Mackness -

Many thanks Sylvia for organising all this and all your help and advice.


In reply to Sylvia Currie

Re: 19 November Webinar

by Sylvia Currie -

As promised, here are the links that were mentioned in the webinar today:

And also captures of our whiteboard activities.



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In reply to Sylvia Currie

Re: 19 November Webinar - text chat transcript (LONG)

by Sylvia Currie -

This is the text chat transcript from yesterday's session. I include it in the body of the post (instead of an attachment) so it is included in fourm searches. It's quite long though! 

Nov 19, 2013 10:00:42 AM - SCOPE - COMMUNITY EVENTS

Footprints of Emergence
Roy Williams, Jenny Mackness, Simone Gumtau

00:03 - DeirdreB
You are so welcome

00:05 - Jenny Mackness
Helo Barbie

00:28 - Scott Johnson
Hi Helen, don't tell Lisa I'm playing hooky here:-)

00:31 - Helen Crump @crumphelen
Hello Scott. Good to see you here

00:35 - Jenny Mackness
Hello Catherine

00:50 - Barbie B
Hello Jenny

01:00 - Helen Crump @crumphelen
and it's good to see Catherine here too :)

01:12 - Roy
Hi Barbie

01:12 - Catherine Cronin
Hi Jenny, Helen & all :)

01:42 - DeirdreB
I'm Deirdre from the College of Medicine in Saskatchewan Canada

02:34 - Jenny Mackness
Welcome Peter

03:25 - Peter
Hello... great to be here

03:29 - Scott Johnson
Scott from NE Alberta where it is COLD

03:35 - Roy
Hi Peter

03:50 - Peter
Peter from St. John's NL

08:51 - Sylvia Currie

10:13 - Jutta
Roy, could you speak a little bit louder, pelase!

10:52 - Sylvia Currie

11:15 - Roy
Sorry Juta (and all) I will talk louder next time!

11:28 - Jutta
thanx Roy

13:39 - Jutta
what are tangents??

13:47 - Roy
I love 'tangents are your best friend'

13:58 - Jutta
yes, what are tangents?

14:20 - Catherine Cronin
@Roy me too :)

14:54 - Roy
tangents - in geometry, but as a metaphor, they are 'spin offs' from the direction of thought

14:58 - Catherine Cronin
To me, tangents are unexpected directions

15:06 - Peter
is someone speaking???

15:11 - Roy
yes, Catherine

15:11 - Peter
no sound

15:12 - Jutta
aaaah, it's mathematics, interesting

15:12 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
Tagents is what happens when I surf the web

15:19 - Sher Meaney

15:25 - tonycairns
learning without teaching

15:29 - Jutta
I didn't know tangents I called it serendipity

15:35 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
oops, tangents, not tagents

15:41 - Sher Meaney
sound go away?

15:41 - DeirdreB
no sound???

15:43 - Sylvia Currie
Jenny, do you mean to have the mic?

16:14 - Roy
finger malfuntion .. oops

16:24 - Lori Lebowitz
learning is best when the facilitator and learner are both excited about the process

16:33 - tonycairns
hive learning

16:44 - tonycairns
no teachers

16:59 - Roy
or everyone is a teacher?

17:00 - tonycairns

17:11 - tonycairns
everyones a student

17:20 - Catherine Cronin
@Lori I like that... I was thinking along the same lines. In my experience there is often delight at the unexpected learning/directions :)

17:24 - tonycairns
chaos and order

17:40 - tonycairns
relinquishing role of teaching

17:42 - Roy
delight is essential to keep curiosity going, no?

17:42 - Scott Johnson
like the no one can see the whole picture, opens the thinking to not just ourselves

17:53 - tonycairns
new role granny admirer

17:56 - tonycairns

18:01 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
Roy I think it's that everyone is a student and everyone is a teacher

18:10 - tonycairns
role of technology is hig

18:19 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
we help each other, but maybe unintentionally

18:28 - tonycairns
new tecnology replaces memory, processing, analysis

18:41 - tonycairns
the replacement of prescription

18:41 - Roy
agreed Mary

18:45 - tonycairns
deat of text

18:50 - tonycairns
and teaching

19:10 - tonycairns
post teaching

19:18 - Catherine Cronin
what a lovely learning space!

19:27 - tonycairns
self learning

19:53 - tonycairns
self reinforcing system

20:05 - tonycairns
peer teaching

20:20 - Roy
hopefully self-correction too

20:20 - tonycairns
teacher free learning

20:48 - tonycairns
learning by instinct inspiration not instruction

21:09 - tonycairns
togeter or alone decide learning

21:30 - Roy
welcome paige ...

21:56 - tonycairns
revolution eveolution or re(ev)olution of learning

22:06 - tonycairns
all lurking is good

22:14 - Sylvia Currie
The forum: http://scope.bccampus.ca/mod/forum/view.php?id=9408

22:15 - tonycairns
levels of confidence to interact

22:25 - tonycairns
cultural aspects of involvement

22:34 - tonycairns
design own assessmnets

22:34 - paigecuffe
thanks roy, multitasking here...

22:45 - Helen Crump @crumphelen
this is really interesting

23:08 - tonycairns
we need to negotiate all learning

23:25 - tonycairns
learning is negotiation of meaning

23:32 - Helen Crump @crumphelen
Hi Paige, I'm multitasking ...on something you sent me earlier ;)

24:01 - Scott Johnson
If we don't care about grading or credits we can recreate emergent learning within any classroom, until you are ejected anyway.

24:01 - tonycairns
360 assessmnet

24:14 - paigecuffe
@helen :-))

24:23 - tonycairns
self peer "teacher" institution college cademy university government

24:34 - tonycairns
evaluation on fly

25:56 - Roy
and when this is done, we'll give you an opportunity to tell us about it in more detail.

26:08 - Roy

27:29 - tonycairns
negotiate as you go

27:55 - tonycairns
meaure of capacity for disorder

28:04 - tonycairns
measure of openess to new ideas

28:08 - tonycairns
myers briggs

28:08 - Roy
Lori, you need to press 'talk' at the top to talk ...

28:15 - tonycairns
genes for extroversion

28:20 - Lori Lebowitz
trying to write & don't know how

28:37 - tonycairns
degree of ability to cope with multiple ideas at same time

28:40 - Roy
Lori, you want to take the mike and speak instead?

28:41 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
Open course but not MOOC

28:49 - DeirdreB
traditional course

28:51 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
not massive

28:56 - Sylvia Currie
Lori, do you see the tools on the whiteboard?

28:56 - Barbie B
UNB BEd Adult Ed online courses included work by Patrica Cranton on Transformative Learning

29:00 - Peter
self-determined self-designed courses

29:02 - Heli Nurmi
I participate in edcmooc again and it's very emergent

29:04 - simone gumtau
to type, select the 'A' text type tool in the floating tool bar

29:18 - Catherine Cronin
Traditional undergraduate course, but moving towards more open & peer assessment

29:25 - tonycairns
we use technology differently here as we are at the end of the eart (ok middle earth) we make up our own rules and systems we do not know what is wrong

29:30 - tonycairns

30:01 - Helen Crump @crumphelen
this is last open course I participated in - v. emergent

30:21 - Sylvia Currie
Most have have been non-credit - professional development, some open, and MOOCs

30:23 - Jutta
looks like I'm a coward (I'm JP)

30:26 - Roy
Helen, which course?

30:31 - paigecuffe
pc = online and blended undergraduate and postgraduate modules. U/G commonly about 3000 students per cohort

31:08 - Catherine Cronin
@paige wow - what subject/discipline(s)

31:17 - Jutta
In Austria we are mostly teaching in a conservative manner

31:26 - tonycairns
ok happy to share

31:29 - paigecuffe
2 faculites at U/G, psychology and science level 1

31:31 - DeirdreB
I do faculty development

31:37 - Catherine Cronin
really interesting, @tony

31:49 - tonycairns
we design and make our own systems

31:57 - tonycairns
we are a bit anarchic

31:58 - Helen Crump @crumphelen
#xplrpln - exploring personal learning networks - it was a 5 wk open online seminar that just finished. It was problem based

32:04 - Peter
great work!!!

32:05 - Lori Lebowitz
just developing my own online course

32:06 - Catherine Cronin
thanks @Paige

32:13 - tonycairns
I thought mitras stuff was amazing

32:35 - tonycairns
i pinterests google plus fb tweated and pushed it straight away

32:44 - tonycairns
this was so coool

32:50 - Scott Johnson
Do we we prefer working in a preparted for emergence environment or just go a bit crazy in a "normal" setting. The tension of "breaking the rules' drives some of this.

33:37 - Roy
not toooo much preparation, or it feels too constrained

33:42 - Sylvia Currie
Sugata Mitra: Build a School in hte Cloud video - for viewing later :-) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3jYVe1RGaU

33:56 - Roy
hi Nick, welcome ...

34:05 - tonycairns
role of technologies

34:09 - Nick
hi roy

34:11 - tonycairns
role of English

34:16 - tonycairns
role of IT

34:33 - tonycairns
tyranny of english

34:42 - Nick
hi to all, just discovered this, it emerged form my inbox :)

34:43 - tonycairns
the language too

35:27 - Scott Johnson
Growing up in the 60's the power of resistance can be destroyed by too much affordance or accomodation.

35:31 - Catherine Cronin
Great presentation by an undergrade IT students on Hole in the Wall experiment http://www.slideshare.net/Poraich/ptroy-presentation

36:02 - DeirdreB
I thought his work had been discredited? http://donaldclarkplanb.blogspot.co.uk/search?q=mitra

36:05 - tonycairns
good for tool that are ruggedized as oterwise pcs stolen broken vandalized lost sold

36:14 - tonycairns
hole in the wall failed long term

36:19 - tonycairns
but good as start up

36:20 - Jenny Mackness
Yes - there has been criticism of his work Derdre

36:34 - tonycairns
role of gaming and new use of medai

37:07 - tonycairns
bit artificial learn biotechnology for year 12 possible but practical

37:21 - tonycairns
gaming as aopiate of masses

37:38 - tonycairns
also issues with contents in games

37:41 - tonycairns
role of women

37:48 - tonycairns
lack of female avatars

38:00 - tonycairns
great intervention

38:06 - Catherine Cronin
@Deirdre yes, I have read some of the criticisms. One of these is reproduction of power dynamics, particularly re: gender.

38:11 - tonycairns
lots of nay sayers on net on sugata

38:18 - tonycairns
role of big boys

38:24 - tonycairns
loss of small girkls

38:32 - tonycairns
great idea tho

38:41 - tonycairns
experiments done 1999

38:48 - tonycairns
wonder how its moved on from there

39:03 - tonycairns
easy to criticise

39:08 - tonycairns
i think its great

39:15 - tonycairns
i think its exciting

39:19 - tonycairns
student lead

39:26 - tonycairns
learning integrated in liffe

39:26 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
I wonder what it was like when the kids went into more formal enviros if they had become accustomed to having more control over their own learning

39:27 - Peter
look to OLPC and how they dropped a few of these boxes in a remote african village

39:33 - paigecuffe
@Catherine glad to see the gender issues raised -not trivial

39:40 - tonycairns
ore colonialsim??

40:16 - Peter
surgery <smile>

40:24 - paigecuffe
where a corpus of knowledge is needed to avoid killing patients... ;-)

40:34 - Roy
children moving back into prescribed schools can find it confusing - my daughter did when she went from Montessori preschool to state primary - and found she wasnt allowed to help other learners

41:18 - Nick
is there a definiton of emergent learning you are working with here?

42:04 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
@Roy, I can see that - same story for the other way around I think - ppl used to more prescribed learning are a bit lost when given control

42:06 - Roy
Nick, there is, many agents interacting frequently with minimal constraints, for unexpected outcomes.

42:12 - Nick

42:29 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
I have heard students say "just tell us what you want us to do!"

43:04 - simone gumtau
@Mary I agree, this is a real issue

43:17 - Roy
Mitra proposes learners start off with the big questions, and learn the skills en route to finding out how to answer them.

43:49 - Scott Johnson
@Mary, they can learn that stuff at Mcdonalds

43:57 - tonycairns
emergent makes teachers redundant

44:00 - Lori Lebowitz
There seems to be an undetermined ratio depending upon the background and education of the student

44:19 - paigecuffe
Are we only designing for the 'model' student? What about less model students?

44:23 - tonycairns
we lose control we lose respect we lose role of teacher as prescriber

44:29 - Catherine Cronin
Great discussion! :)

44:42 - tonycairns
i welcome emergent teaching but will replace teaching

44:47 - tonycairns
as we know it now

45:19 - Roy
designing for emergence must try to accommodate all - see Simone's work on MEDIATE - for children on the autistic spectrum, which was wonderfully open

45:20 - tonycairns
loss of professionalism

45:34 - Catherine Cronin
@Paige - I think about that question a lot, and it raised its head this week with Udacity news of course...

45:38 - tonycairns
loss f society and cultural rle as google replaces memory

45:50 - Roy
Udacity news?

45:51 - tonycairns
we lose the right to say what and why and when to lean

45:56 - tonycairns

46:03 - paigecuffe
@roy, do you have a URL? sounds interesting

46:42 - Catherine Cronin
@Roy Sebastian Thrun that Udacity MOOCs will no longer seek to "revolutionize" higher education (moving to commercial training). Will post a link.

46:46 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
Fast company article on Udacity's founder's change of thinking: http://www.fastcompany.com/3021473/udacity-sebastian-thrun-uphill-climb

46:49 - Nick
udacity "pivoted", they are going to focus on corporate from now on

46:53 - Catherine Cronin
Thanks Mary!

46:55 - Roy
sure: footprints-of-emergence.wikispace.com,

47:04 - tonycairns
we risk erosion and loss of role of teaching replacement by machines as stated by artur c clarke in video on youtube

47:06 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
read it yesterday, v. interesting!

47:08 - Peter
I believe we need to focus more on children to teach themselves. by the time they graduate they should know how to be an autodidact

47:19 - Peter
grade 12 graduation

47:27 - Nick
which ia amassive abiout turn from only 10 universities in 50 years time

47:36 - tonycairns
they are autoidact when they come to usmaybe we hold them back

47:46 - Peter
I agree

47:50 - Roy
Catherine. Oh no. Futurelearn, UK, is looking highly conservative too - see my tweets @dustcube recnntly

48:01 - paigecuffe
@Roy - wonderful!! thank you.

48:03 - tonycairns
my 8 year ols wants youtube channe for her and her friends all 8 to load gaming video tutorials

48:08 - tonycairns
she has made on to it

48:14 - tonycairns
way beyound what i am doing

48:15 - Jutta
I love them :-)

48:19 - Sylvia Currie
Wonderful, Jutta!

48:23 - Roy
I think the MOOC revolution is already being taken over by the conservative establishment.

48:27 - Jutta
We could do a footprint about today ;-)

48:30 - tonycairns
the 8 year olds are further advanced than us

48:30 - Peter
you let your kids use computers?

48:44 - Peter
ask them to sew or knit

48:45 - tonycairns
we insist they use computers from birth

48:46 - Roy
Absolutely Jutta

49:01 - tonycairns
we use technology 24/7 everywhere

49:04 - tonycairns
we are wired

49:29 - tonycairns
all kids carry multipe devices to access net

49:33 - tonycairns
we live on te net

49:34 - Catherine Cronin
Good "failure of Udacity" summary by Stephen Downes http://www.downes.ca/

49:39 - paigecuffe
looking forward to seeing these as standard in post-course surveys

49:42 - tonycairns
we skype class to class

49:51 - Roy
thanks for the link Catherine

50:13 - tonycairns
we email fb ask twitter video

50:16 - Catherine Cronin
@roy thanks for that link :)

50:19 - Sylvia Currie

50:22 - paigecuffe
make a fantastic way to compare across courses too ...

50:47 - tonycairns
can we make the footprints by manipulating 20 or so key leavers to creat footprints on the fly

50:57 - Sylvia Currie
BEtreat - A fantastic workshop!

50:59 - tonycairns
can we track in real time the interchane

51:01 - Jutta
No, we didn't meet at the betreat, we met at Change11!

51:11 - Roy
there is more on MEDIATE in a paper we have coming out in Leonardo in 2014 - we can send you a copy if you want, and Simone has lots more in her research

51:13 - tonycairns
visulaize the experinece

51:19 - tonycairns
track the sinteractions

51:22 - Jutta
BEtreat, a strange experience for onliners...

51:24 - tonycairns
track the attitudes

51:26 - Sylvia Currie
Easy to lose track where we meet people these days :-)

51:34 - tonycairns
google glasses feeds and auto analyse

52:01 - tonycairns
we ae devices to measure student invlovement and interaction

52:09 - tonycairns
we could look at metadat from theri data

52:25 - tonycairns
not content just volume frequency and source direction of data

52:36 - Scott Johnson
So this could generate a visual for each person's experience?

52:41 - Catherine Cronin
I've loved your ModPo posts, Jenny :)

52:43 - Sylvia Currie

52:49 - paigecuffe
Lovely snapshot technique of learner change through a course

53:00 - tonycairns
i just like the shapes

53:07 - tonycairns
works for visual learners

53:20 - tonycairns
do the footprints become an end in themselves

53:25 - Roy
Paige - the ability to track the dynamics of change is one of the things that really exites me.

53:28 - Jutta
Yes Tony, I'm a visual type :-)

53:31 - Sylvia Currie

53:47 - DeirdreB
Sorry have a meeting have to leave

53:49 - paigecuffe
Roy this will be one of the things I will follow up!

54:00 - Roy
OK Deirdre, thanks for coming

54:36 - Roy
emails are on the footprints wiki if you want to follow up

54:59 - tonycairns
i think its interesting but would like it multiple feeds from students teachers and assesors mapped over time

55:24 - tonycairns
isnt this a self and peer and student survey shown in a fancy chart

55:31 - Roy
surfacing tacit knowledge and experience is also a big plus in footprints

55:33 - Lori Lebowitz
can't attend next week but would like to keep connected to this...very interesting to me..can I get a copy of what went on?

55:43 - tonycairns
i would love to try it

55:59 - tonycairns
we have the data now from student surveys

56:13 - tonycairns
and can adpat our spreadsheet to make these footprints

56:19 - tonycairns
so its an excel chart

56:21 - Roy
Lori, sure, the wiki is open (you can join too) and you can contact us on email as well

57:10 - tonycairns
i think this is a very useful device

57:11 - Scott Johnson
Factors can be a surprize and great to "see" in a footprint.

57:34 - Sylvia Currie
Here's the blog post link again: http://jennymackness.wordpress.com/2013/09/11/footprints-of-emergence-so-what-2/

57:54 - tonycairns
wonder if we can move it into 3d as a video vsualization over time so we can see how it evolves so footprnt via steps each day

57:57 - Roy
factors require more thought than you would expect, but we find its worth the sweat

58:05 - tonycairns
so evalueat every day same survey

58:11 - tonycairns
in a reflection with students

58:13 - paigecuffe
@tony Yes!!

58:14 - tonycairns
at end of day

58:19 - tonycairns
and map in real time

58:25 - Sher Meaney
Thanks for an interesting workshop. I must go to a meeting now. I'll check the recording later to see what I missed.

58:31 - tonycairns
and rspond to stduets responses

58:56 - tonycairns
so build learning by rsponding ti students

59:09 - Catherine Cronin
Sorry I must leave -- thank you all, hope to join next webinar :)

59:10 - Scott Johnson
We have anticipated every possible factor only to be undone by an emerging factor:-)

59:27 - Roy
thanks Catherine

59:40 - Mary Burgess (BCcampus)
This has been so interesting, thank you so much!

1:00:21 - Roy
thanks Mary

1:00:48 - Sylvia Currie
The conversation continues... http://scope.bccampus.ca/mod/forum/view.php?id=9408

1:01:10 - Roy
adding a timeline to animate the dynamics of changes would be superb ...

1:01:34 - Scott Johnson
Do let management hear about footprints or we'll be burried under them.

1:02:25 - Roy
tony - sounds great

1:02:39 - tonycairns
sounds great

1:02:47 - tonycairns
clusters sound perfect

1:02:59 - paigecuffe
Need to go, Thank you - really fired me up!

1:03:03 - tonycairns
yes sliders

1:03:11 - Scott Johnson
By Paige

1:03:16 - tonycairns
sounds wonderful

1:03:23 - tonycairns
i think this can work

1:03:23 - Roy
thanks paige

1:03:50 - tonycairns
i will ask our maths and claculus students to try prgramming it

1:04:08 - Sylvia Currie

1:04:24 - Jutta
sorry, I cannot come next time!

1:04:27 - Sylvia Currie

1:04:29 - tonycairns
thanks a million gotta get the kids to school make lunces thanks people its been a blat

1:04:31 - Roy
thank you all for contributing - great session - so much to think about!

1:04:33 - tonycairns
i have loved this

1:04:37 - Heli Nurmi

1:04:44 - tonycairns
its a work in prgress

1:04:50 - tonycairns
and i will try it next year

1:04:50 - Roy
good to see you Heli

1:05:03 - Jutta
thanx, it was enteresting :-)

1:05:17 - Roy
thanks Jutta, love your work

1:05:19 - Sylvia Currie
I'll post these links in the SCoPE discussion as well

1:05:29 - Scott Johnson
Thanks everyone

1:05:39 - tonycairns
thanks a million can you email us those 3 links they look great

1:05:39 - Nick

1:05:48 - Nick
ok thanks

1:05:50 - Sylvia Currie
Yes, I will!

1:05:59 - tonycairns
thanks amillion

1:06:02 - Jenny Mackness
Thanks - I can't access the mic now

1:06:02 - tonycairns
tony out

1:06:25 - Nick
bye, lovely serendipitous surprise for me, truly emergent!!!

1:06:39 - Roy
Nick, great!

1:07:33 - Jutta
bye bye

1:07:41 - Roy

1:07:48 - Hilda Anggraeni

1:07:49 - Hilda Anggraeni